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 Megasquirt for Dummies: 20v 4AGE [No 56k]First  < 23 24 25 26 27 >  Last
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wrenchdad


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339 posts [100%]
Natchez MS

 Re: (wrenchdad) » Reply  Edit


Just an update, I did re-do my injector test and the new info in posted in that same link above.

later wd



" Second place is just the first loser" the late Dale Earnhardt
AE86Taylor




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267 posts [100%]
Warner Robins Georgia

 Re: (wrenchdad) » Reply  Edit


You're awesome man. Thanks



My daughter's web pagehttp://madalynswalk.tripod.com
Sponsored by http://www.diyautotune.com


Madalyn Clare Lively 23 SEP 2004 - 03 FEB 2005
"There are those who have dreamed of angels, but I have held one in my arms."

wrenchdad


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339 posts [100%]
Natchez MS

 Re: (AE86Taylor) » Reply  Edit


Don't know about that! Just trying to give a little back to MS family !

later wd



" Second place is just the first loser" the late Dale Earnhardt
AE86Taylor




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267 posts [100%]
Warner Robins Georgia

 Re: (wrenchdad) » Reply  Edit


Well now, you do know.

I'm using the msg you sent. I've run into some snags. Coil packs started getting hot. I did the switching ground setup for the coil packs as instructed. At least I think I did it right... the resistor from D14 is going to js10, and the resistor on D16 is going to SPR4. Pin 1 on the coil packs is connected to ground, pin 2 is connected to IGN pin on Ms and pin 2 on the other coil is connected to pin 6 on Ms, pin 3 in connected to nothing, and pin 4 is connected to a switched 12v source. The other thing is the trigger wheel. I'm using a 36-1 on the crank, and I'm using the EDIS VR sensor. When the engine is at TDC the missing tooth is at TDC as well. The VR sensor is located 90 degrees to the right of TDC. Tuner Studio wants the location of the first tooth BTDC and I'm not 100% certain what to put. Only things I changed in the msq file you sent was the trigger wheel type and the first tooth location. Any advice you can give would be great. Would love to get this thing running. Thanks again.



My daughter's web pagehttp://madalynswalk.tripod.com
Sponsored by http://www.diyautotune.com


Madalyn Clare Lively 23 SEP 2004 - 03 FEB 2005
"There are those who have dreamed of angels, but I have held one in my arms."

wrenchdad


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339 posts [100%]
Natchez MS

 Re: (AE86Taylor) » Reply  Edit


OK, I think you have your coils wired correctly if you and I are counting the pins in the same direction, left to right looking into the coil male connector.

BUT I had to change the firing direction when I went to COPS so check which way you have going high or going low. For these it needs to be going high (inverted) at least it has to be on MS3. but that would be the one setting to switch if they are getting hot. Also the max dwell should be between 2.1 and 2.5. I tested mine at 2.5 and they barely got warm, that pulled out with a spare set of plugs installed in them and grounded of course. I let them run for a while at 2.5, no problems, cranking dwell at 4.0

So check those things and you should be ok on your spark. now on the angle, how many teeth is if from your sensor until you get to TDC? Hard for me to figure what you mean by "90 degrees to the right of TDC". How about clockwise or counterclockwise? Like I said before, never used a crank wheel, jus the stock dizzy for sensors. but if its about 90 degrees away then try that I guess. If that doesn't work then try 270 for the other side of the coin.

let me know what you progress you make or not, later wd



" Second place is just the first loser" the late Dale Earnhardt
muythaibxr


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1035 posts [100%]

 Re: (wrenchdad) » Reply  Edit


Ms2 with pullups on the LEDs needs the opposite spark output polarity to ms3 with ms3x.
AE86Taylor




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267 posts [100%]
Warner Robins Georgia

 Re: (wrenchdad) » Reply  Edit


OK, sorry for the late reply. been busy dealing with seperation and impending divorce. Needless to say I have gotten more done on this car in the last 3 months she's been gone than I have in the last 2 years. Anyway....

Tried starting the car again.... I'm getting fuel, and an RPM reading.... No spark...
I tried Normal and Inverted and the coils are still getting hot. I tried rewiring the coils, now they stay cold (they dont ever get warm so i think they are wired wrong) but I still have no spark.

When I turn the key the D14 and D16 stay lit... not sure if this has to do with the two 330 Ohm resistors going to 5v in the proto area to the negative leg of the LED.

As for the trigger wheel and sensor, when the engine is at top dead center, the missing tooth of my 36-1 trigger wheel is straight up (perpendicular to the ground). the sensor is 8 teeth (90 degrees) to the right (clockwise) of the missing tooth.

I'm going nuts here. I'm so close to having this thing running that is driving me crazy. Somebody help! LOL





My daughter's web pagehttp://madalynswalk.tripod.com
Sponsored by http://www.diyautotune.com


Madalyn Clare Lively 23 SEP 2004 - 03 FEB 2005
"There are those who have dreamed of angels, but I have held one in my arms."

AE86Taylor




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267 posts [100%]
Warner Robins Georgia

 Re: (wrenchdad) » Reply  Edit


I think i may have discovered another problem, and i'm hoping i haven't damaged my MS. Looking back over everything, the instructions i followed for setting up for "ground switching" wasted spark for MS2Extra may be wrong. For D14 one instruction tells me to run a wire from the resistor connected to the negative leg of D14 to IGNOUT. Yet both diagrams asre labeled running the wire to IGN. But there are 2 "IGN" spots on the bottom of the V3.0 board. The first is next to the IGNOUT spot, and the other is JS10 which says JS10 (IGN) on the bottom of the board.....

So where does D14 need to go?

JS10(IGN)?

IGN?

or IGNOUT?

Thanks again for any help.



My daughter's web pagehttp://madalynswalk.tripod.com
Sponsored by http://www.diyautotune.com


Madalyn Clare Lively 23 SEP 2004 - 03 FEB 2005
"There are those who have dreamed of angels, but I have held one in my arms."

AE86Taylor




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267 posts [100%]
Warner Robins Georgia

  » Reply  Edit


Anyone???

I've even tried calling Diyautotune, where I got the ECU from and can't get tech support on the phone...



My daughter's web pagehttp://madalynswalk.tripod.com
Sponsored by http://www.diyautotune.com


Madalyn Clare Lively 23 SEP 2004 - 03 FEB 2005
"There are those who have dreamed of angels, but I have held one in my arms."

wrenchdad


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339 posts [100%]
Natchez MS

 Re: (AE86Taylor) » Reply  Edit


I'll take a look at my spare MS unit tomorrow and let you know.

wd



" Second place is just the first loser" the late Dale Earnhardt
AE86Taylor




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267 posts [100%]
Warner Robins Georgia

 Re: (wrenchdad) » Reply  Edit


Thanks man. I'm ready to stop driving a minivan ... lol



My daughter's web pagehttp://madalynswalk.tripod.com
Sponsored by http://www.diyautotune.com


Madalyn Clare Lively 23 SEP 2004 - 03 FEB 2005
"There are those who have dreamed of angels, but I have held one in my arms."

wrenchdad


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339 posts [100%]
Natchez MS

 Re: (AE86Taylor) » Reply  Edit


I haven't forgotten, crazy stuff at work, got switched to 12 hour nights !!

wd



" Second place is just the first loser" the late Dale Earnhardt
AE86Taylor




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267 posts [100%]
Warner Robins Georgia

 Re: (wrenchdad) » Reply  Edit


I hear ya man. Its cool. I'm actually getting ready to head to work at 11. Owl shift with differential pay FTW. LOL



My daughter's web pagehttp://madalynswalk.tripod.com
Sponsored by http://www.diyautotune.com


Madalyn Clare Lively 23 SEP 2004 - 03 FEB 2005
"There are those who have dreamed of angels, but I have held one in my arms."

wrenchdad


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339 posts [100%]
Natchez MS

 Re: (AE86Taylor) » Reply  Edit


Quote, originally posted by AE86Taylor »
I think i may have discovered another problem, and i'm hoping i haven't damaged my MS. Looking back over everything, the instructions i followed for setting up for "ground switching" wasted spark for MS2Extra may be wrong. For D14 one instruction tells me to run a wire from the resistor connected to the negative leg of D14 to IGNOUT. Yet both diagrams asre labeled running the wire to IGN. But there are 2 "IGN" spots on the bottom of the V3.0 board. The first is next to the IGNOUT spot, and the other is JS10 which says JS10 (IGN) on the bottom of the board.....

So where does D14 need to go?

JS10(IGN)?

IGN?

or IGNOUT?

Thanks again for any help.

Ok, I don't have my spare MS with me at work (what a surprise !!) but I think I have found the diagram that you are talking about and I see what you mean by "IGNOUT", "JS10" (IGN) and "IGN".

First the JS10, is a direct hookup to the CPU chip, so DO NOT connect to it without using a 1K resistor to protect the chip, I used this one for my TACH output with the proper circuit to drive my dash tach. SO it is IGN just not for what you want. DON"T use it with the ground switching circuit you would be connecting an output to an input !

I am still trying to confirm this but I am thinking that the "IGNOUT" is for using the high current driver for the base setup of a single coil, IF, I said IF you were using that circuit you would jumper IGNOUT to the IGN pad next to it to get the signal out of the DB37 connector, OK? but I am not 100% on that until I take a look at my board. again not your setup.

SO with all that said, you would want your spark A to go to the pad IGN so it would go out on pin 36 of the DB37 using that ground switching circuit and your spark B going to a spare pin of the DB37 which are pins 3, 4, 5 and 6 for spares 1, 2, 3 and 4 respectively. Also using the ground switching circuit. OK? here is a link to the board circuits that may help you see it.
http://www.msextra.com/doc/gen....html

I also think I ended up using a different value for the resistor, like 330 ohms instead of 1K I will check. I will try to remember to pop the top of my spare unit when I get home, but after having a doc appt yesterday that kept me up until noon and only getting about 5 hours sleep not sure how good I will be thinking in the morning !!
later wd



" Second place is just the first loser" the late Dale Earnhardt
AE86Taylor




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267 posts [100%]
Warner Robins Georgia

 Re: (wrenchdad) » Reply  Edit


Well, unfortunately I have already powered the unit up with D14 wired to JS10.... oops. But the unit still works. I switched it to IGN and tried to start the car again... still no spark. I have D16 connected to SPR4. And that is connected to the second coil. No spark there either. And I am using 330 ohm 1/2 Watt resistors like you said. Now what?



My daughter's web pagehttp://madalynswalk.tripod.com
Sponsored by http://www.diyautotune.com


Madalyn Clare Lively 23 SEP 2004 - 03 FEB 2005
"There are those who have dreamed of angels, but I have held one in my arms."

wrenchdad


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339 posts [100%]
Natchez MS

 Re: (AE86Taylor) » Reply  Edit


Well, then its time to go back to the basics, re-check your power to the coils and make sure you don't have a bad relay or fuse blown, recheck your firing order to make sure you have the correct cylinders paired together. Pull the plugs and make sure that they haven't gotten fuel soaked and are now fouled. May have to get some help but also check to make sure you have power to the coils when key is in the start position along with the run position.

One other thing, are you seeing cranking RPMs on your laptop?

later wd



" Second place is just the first loser" the late Dale Earnhardt
wrenchdad


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339 posts [100%]
Natchez MS

 Re: (AE86Taylor) » Reply  Edit


Quote, originally posted by AE86Taylor »
...................but I still have no spark.

When I turn the key the D14 and D16 stay lit... not sure if this has to do with the two 330 Ohm resistors going to 5v in the proto area to the negative leg of the LED.

That doesn't sound right, D14 and D16 should not light up and stay "ON" with just the key on. They should flash with rpms. SO I would recheck the board mods, thinking you maybe on the wrong side/leg of the LEDs.

later wd

EDIT: I checked the data sheet on the transistors for the LEDs and they are rated at "200ma continuous" SO its possible that when your coils got HOT that time you might have killed the transistors with too much current. That may be why they are "ON" all the time with the key on but no rpms. later wd

Modified by wrenchdad at 12:32 AM 12/2/2011



" Second place is just the first loser" the late Dale Earnhardt
20v silvertop
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28 posts [100%]
longisland ny

 Re: (wrenchdad) » Reply  Edit


Just did my engine swap. Tried to start the car, but Im not getting any spark. To my knowledge...to get a spark you need a battery, ignitor, coil, computer and ignition. Am I missing something?
20v silvertop
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28 posts [100%]
longisland ny

 Re: (20v silvertop) » Reply  Edit


if my computer was messed up would i get any power to the igniter, coil and ignition? cause i'm getting power to them but i just aint getting no spark.
Foundsoul


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60 posts [100%]

 Re: (20v silvertop) » Reply  Edit


Are you getting a nice stable RPM signal in the tuning software when you're cranking? No sync loss? That's the first thing to look for if you're not getting spark or firing the injectors. The ECU is not going to fire the plugs or injectors if it doesn't see that the engine is cranking...




Jerry a.k.a. 'FoundSoul'
http://www.DIYAutoTune.com
wrenchdad


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339 posts [100%]
Natchez MS

 Re: (20v silvertop) » Reply  Edit


It would probably help if you would tell us your setup. Like what ECU, firmware, etc.

Quote, originally posted by 20v silvertop »
Just did my engine swap. Tried to start the car, but Im not getting any spark. To my knowledge...to get a spark you need a battery, ignitor, coil, computer and ignition. Am I missing something?

Seeing you are talking about an igintor, I will "guess" and say that you are using the stock ignition setup. First question, is the ignitor ground correctly? Lack of good grounds cause lots of grief when it comes to engine swaps.

wd



" Second place is just the first loser" the late Dale Earnhardt
rc.square24
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326 posts [100%]
Vancouver BC

 Re: (20v silvertop) » Reply  Edit


No offence but I think you'll get better advice and keep discussions on topic if you create a new thread on the main 20v forum instead of posting in the megasquirt and rwd water pump threads when you're running stock ignition and ECU.
AE86Taylor




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267 posts [100%]
Warner Robins Georgia

 Re: (wrenchdad) » Reply  Edit


I'm on thebside of the LED that the diagram said to be on. The negative.



My daughter's web pagehttp://madalynswalk.tripod.com
Sponsored by http://www.diyautotune.com


Madalyn Clare Lively 23 SEP 2004 - 03 FEB 2005
"There are those who have dreamed of angels, but I have held one in my arms."

wrenchdad


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339 posts [100%]
Natchez MS

 Re: (AE86Taylor) » Reply  Edit


Ok, that should be correct but what I am concerned about is that you said that the coils got real hot once and that may have damaged the transistors that drive the LEDs.

SO how about this for a test, seeing you don't have a stim, unplug all spark and injectors. Then save your MSQ then reconfig your setup to a stock dizzy spark setup, in other words, do not use the LEDs for spark. do a burn and restart, and lets see if the LEDs will do their normal functions. Just to see if they will turn on and off. D14 would be used for injectors and D16 is for accel shot. I think you will get at least a quick flash of the injector when it does the priming pulse and if you set up your accel to TPS then you should be able to see it work also.

try that and lets see if the transistors are still working, later wd



" Second place is just the first loser" the late Dale Earnhardt
apexi3016
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8 posts [100%]
Lahad Datu Sabah

 No Spark. » Reply  Edit


Hi Guys,

I'm from Malaysia running a 20V in a KE70.

I bought the MS2 kit in 2009, got it in the car and cranking only yesterday... took me that long..

Running MSExtra Rel 2.1.0p

I'm using the stock dizzy as the CAS on 1NZ COP's using 5V pullup to fire them.

In the screenshot attached is my settings.

Below is what i have for now:

1. when i turn the key on (power to MS). all three LED's light up. i'm not sure if this is normal. When i crank i can see the LED's flicker ever so slightly.

2. All COP's fire once, when the power is turned on to MS. Not good as it ignited the fuel in the cylinders and had a fireball thru the exhaust. I Verified this by removing each plug, grounding it and turning the key on, for all four plugs.

3. Removed all the plugs and cranked and on TS my max crank RPM is about 265. This should indicate that my 2nd VR conditioner is fine.

I do not understand how to set tooth #1 angle, its a bit confusing for me and below is what i did as per > http://www.msextra.com/doc/ms2....html:

1. Set engine at TDC compression cyl #1.

2.Rotated the engine backwards until the single tooth aligns with cam sensor (being the one below the 24 tooth). I had to go more than 360" and in the instruction it says to add 360". Question is where do i get the degree value for tooth #1 angle from, do i use a degree wheel? for now i've just put 20 degrees. so i'm a bit lost at this point. Hope someone can point me in the correct direction. Hopefully this is why i'm not getting spark.

Hope you guys can point me in the right direction.

wrenchdad


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339 posts [100%]
Natchez MS

 Re: No Spark. (apexi3016) » Reply  Edit


Quote, originally posted by apexi3016 »
......Running MSExtra Rel 2.1.0p

I'm using the stock dizzy as the CAS on 1NZ COP's using 5V pullup to fire them.

Below is what i have for now:

1. when i turn the key on (power to MS). all three LED's light up. i'm not sure if this is normal. When i crank i can see the LED's flicker ever so slightly.

2. All COP's fire once, when the power is turned on to MS. Not good as it ignited the fuel in the cylinders and had a fireball thru the exhaust. I Verified this by removing each plug, grounding it and turning the key on, for all four plugs.

3. Removed all the plugs and cranked and on TS my max crank RPM is about 265. This should indicate that my 2nd VR conditioner is fine.

I do not understand how to set tooth #1 angle, its a bit confusing for me and below is what i did as per > http://www.msextra.com/doc/ms2....html:

1. Set engine at TDC compression cyl #1.

2.Rotated the engine backwards until the single tooth aligns with cam sensor (being the one below the 24 tooth). I had to go more than 360" and in the instruction it says to add 360". Question is where do i get the degree value for tooth #1 angle from, do i use a degree wheel? for now i've just put 20 degrees. so i'm a bit lost at this point. Hope someone can point me in the correct direction. Hopefully this is why i'm not getting spark.

Hope you guys can point me in the right direction.

Ok,

First, you are saying that ALL four COPs are firing at the same time? Then how do you have the spark output wired? Sounds like you want either wasted spark or full seq spark, posting a MSQ file would be a much, much better way of showing your settings, OK? SO, what are you connected to for spark out? LEDs? or what?

On your second VR input being ok, sounds like it will be BUT it would be better to use the tooth logger function in TS to do that you will have to register TS to get out of "lite" mode. The reason I say this is that you might be ok at cranking speed but have problems at higher rpms which would require that you log your tooth inputs to be able to see what is wrong.

Figuring your tooth degrees, 24 teeth in dizzy divided into 360 gives 15 degrees per tooth THEN tiimes 2 for the cam turning half speed of the crank, for 30 degress per tooth in crank degrees. Also you need to remember that there are TWO G sensors in the dizzy so you need to be sure which one to count from, OK?

I also have to ask, do you have a Stim? Its best to have one to make sure that your MS is set up correctly before installing in the car, helps to determine where the problem is either MS or car harness.

You are getting spark or the COPs would not be firing,correct? You are just not getting it at the right time. hopefully all this will help, you also may want to use one of the later firmware codes, they have more features. I would also suggest you turn on " Include AFR Targets" under the secondary load parameters window, that allows you to change you targets without have to do a retune.

later wd

wrenchdad


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339 posts [100%]
Natchez MS

 Re: No Spark. (apexi3016) » Reply  Edit


OK, after taking a second look at your screen shot, you really need to update your firmware to the latest relaease which is 3.1.1, see this link.

http://www.msextra.com/forums/...39013

The main reason is that it has the ITB mode which makes tuning these 20v much, much easier. So save your msq file and then flash your MS to that firmware. Make sure you disconnect all your COPs and injectors BEFORE you flash your MS and double check your spark settings before you reconnect them !!

Then we can see what we can come up with on your settings.

later wd





" Second place is just the first loser" the late Dale Earnhardt
rc.square24
Member



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326 posts [100%]
Vancouver BC

  » Reply  Edit


Would a V3 Microsquirt (uS) work for a 20v to run COPs using the stock cam/crank sensor (without cutting any teeth off)?

I've read several places that the stock CAS would require a second VR conditioner. Is this different from the VR1 and VR2 inputs I see on the uS guide?

Sorry I'm a bit confused with so much information on MS and mod circuits. I dont have anything yet just looking / researching on the possibility of converting to uS/MS after I get my swap done with stock electronics working so I can swap the stock ECU in case while I sort out the standalone.

http://www.useasydocs.com/details/pinout.htm

Russ




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758 posts [100%]
Lawrenceville GA

 Re: (rc.square24) » Reply  Edit


Yes the MicroSquirt ECU could run COPs and read from the stock CAS. There are only two logic level ignition outputs so they would need to be COPs with igniters built in and you would need to fire them wasted spark.

You can run wasted spark off either 20V pattern. Some have a 24 tooth wheel and a 2 tooth wheel while others have a 24 tooth wheel and a 1 tooth wheel. 24 & 2 can only do wasted spark while 24 & 1 can do wasted spark or full sequential, that is if you have an ECU that supports 4 cylinder sequential outputs.

The MicroSquirt comes with two VR input circuits already. You hear of people adding a 2nd because the conventional MegaSquirt boards only have one.

rc.square24
Member



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326 posts [100%]
Vancouver BC

 Re: (Russ) » Reply  Edit


Thanks for the reply.

Quote »
Yes the MicroSquirt ECU could run COPs and read from the stock CAS. There are only two logic level ignition outputs so they would need to be COPs with igniters built in and you would need to fire them wasted spark.

I have a set of 1NZ 4-pin Denso COPs I believe they have igniter built in.

Quote »
24 & 2 can only do wasted spark while 24 & 1 can do wasted spark or full sequential, that is if you have an ECU that supports 4 cylinder sequential outputs.

I thought (from reading online) all 20v had 24+1 CAS, I'll have to check on mine then. What do you mean by "an ECU that supports 4 cylinder sequential outputs."? Can/is the Microsquirt be set up for this or what am I looking in the documents to find out?

http://www.msextra.com/doc/ms2...matic

** OK i think i get what you mean, I'll have to run wasted spark with uS. That wont be a problem running with batch fire injection right (2 injector outputs on uS)? (both injectors and spark working in alternating pairs)

Quote »
The MicroSquirt comes with two VR input circuits already. You hear of people adding a 2nd because the conventional MegaSquirt boards only have one.

So it will be able to read the 20V CAS straight from the 4 pins (I read I only need one G and Ne, GND so 3). Would it be a problem that G1, G2, Ne in stock wiring shares the same ground?

One other thing is VVT control, would the Microsquirt be able to have an output for that? I see no spare output pins in the manual but only two spare inputs, and notes of the capability of ACCEL and WARMUP LEDs being used for output.

As for the PWM ISCV I see a circuit schematic posted in this thread for driving it with FIDLE, uS will work with this add-on I assume?

Thanks again and I'll post more questions as I come along anything i'm unclear of.

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